SwiftJustice88 | 8 points
Is Fluvoxamine even better than Ivermectin for early treatment?[-] foggynotion | 2 points
why would anyone choose an SSRI over ivermectin? They alter your neurochemistry, so I dont even see why this drug is being proposed...
According to Steve Kirsch, fluvoxamine should help in the cases where IVM doesn't (remember, IVM is not 100%) and also prevent long-covid brain fog, because unlike IVM, fluvoxamine can get to the brain.
The dosage and especially length of treatment should be low enough that one doesn't develop the kind of addiction that makes it hard to get off anti-depressants. I'd rather have my neurochemistry temporarily altered for a few weeks than die, dunno.
[-] foggynotion | 1 points
ah gotcha, sounds promising
[-] Affectionate_Market8 | 1 points
ssris do not permanently alter said chemistry. It could be used until vaccination perhaps
[-] Haitchpeasauce | 9 points | Apr 24 2021 09:52:46
As an SSRI, Fluvoxamine needs to be handled with care and most definitely under the supervision of a physician. The drug is more dose sensitive, and playing around with serotonin can have negative effects. The studies use low doses that are considered safe, and the early data we have so far shows it is a powerful therapy for COVID-19 and long haulers. It is a great tool to have. Given Ivermectin's high tolerance and safety it is a more suitable first line early intervention, reserving Fluvoxamine for more advanced cases and for long haulers. I don't consider them competing drugs, we need every tool we can get our hands on to fight this pandemic and prevent deaths.
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[-] stereomatch | 3 points | Apr 24 2021 10:28:23
So dosage as mentioned by Steven Kirsch is 50mg twice a day for 2 weeks.
Is that the typical dose or do they use higher doses in some circumstances.
Also my superficial understanding (since I haven't devoted too much time to Fluvoxamine and also don't have real world experience - so have yet to develop a feel for it) is that Fluvoxamine may be especially beneficial for people who have already developing impairment - in lungs etc.
These would be people who are already on steroids (ie are in post-day-8 hyperinflammatory stage) and well into it.
So presumably Fluvoxamine would be added to the existing ivermectin + steroids-at-day-8 protocol.
I would also like to know if one is already taking Famotidine with the ivermectin, should one stop the Famotidine or continue that.
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[-] Haitchpeasauce | 2 points | Apr 24 2021 11:06:49
All good questions I don't have an immediate answer to either.
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[-] DesinasIneptire | 2 points | Apr 24 2021 18:34:59
The association of fluvoxamine and famotidine is counterindicated for risk of QT prolongation and arrhythmias.
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[-] stereomatch | 1 points | Apr 24 2021 19:37:49
Thanks.
It seems Famotidine has not historically been associated with Qt interval elongation (prolongation).
There are a few reports on that - usually individual case reports of seriously ill patients with comorbidities:
https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(99)00328-9/fulltext Famotidine and acquired long QT syndrome August 16, 2004
But there are more convincing ones as well:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25253561/ Analysis of an ECG record database reveals QT interval prolongation potential of famotidine in a large Korean population April 2015
And there is a counter study saying Famotidine is not associated with Qt interval elongation:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/10819177_Famotidine_does_not_induce_long_QT_syndrome_Experimental_evidence_from_in_vitro_and_in_vivo_test_systems Famotidine does not induce long QT syndrome: Experimental evidence from in vitro and in vivo test systems April 2003
These results suggest that famotidine possesses no cardiovascular effects at a therapeutic dose, while it may exert cardiostimulatory actions after drug overdoses that might potentiate the proarrhythmic potential of co-administered cardiotonic agents by increasing the intracellular Ca(2+) concentration.
https://eurjther.com/content/files/sayilar/14/buyuk/9.pdf
Acquired long QT syndrome associated with famotidine has rarely been reported (3,4). To the best of our knowledge the reported patient is the seventh case in the English-language literature.
The mechanism of famotidine-induced long QT is not clearly understood. However, ranitidine - the other H2receptor antagonist - has been shown to inhibit cholinesterase, which may lead to an increase in the acetylcholine level at the nerve endings.
Ranitidine associated bradycardia has been reported in the English-language literature (6), however to the best of our knowledge, ranitidine associated long QT syndrome had not been reported in the literature.
While searching for - Fluvoxamine qt prolongation:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25560394/ Fluvoxamine by itself has potential to directly induce long QT syndrome at supra-therapeutic concentrations Feb 2015
Fluvoxamine was intravenously administered in three escalating doses of 0.1, 1 and 10 mg/kg over 10 min with a pause of 20 min between the doses. The low dose provided therapeutic plasma drug concentration, whereas the middle and high doses attained approximately 10 and 100 times of the therapeutic ones, respectively. Supra-therapeutic concentration of fluvoxamine exerted the negative chronotropic, inotropic and hypotensive effects; and suppressed the atrioventricular nodal and intraventricular conductions, indicating inhibitory actions on Ca2+ and Na+ channels, whereas it delayed the repolarization in a reverse use-dependent manner, reflecting characteristics of rapidly activating delayed rectifier K+ current channel-blocking property. Fluvoxamine prolonged the terminal repolarization phase at 100 times higher concentration than the therapeutic, indicating its proarrhythmic potential. Thus, fluvoxamine by itself has potential to directly induce long QT syndrome at supra-therapeutic concentrations.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24259697/ A comparison of the risk of QT prolongation among SSRIs Oct 2013
Studies demonstrate possible dose-related clinically significant QT prolongation with escitalopram. Fluoxetine, fluvoxamine, and sertraline at traditional doses demonstrate a lack of clinically significant increases in QTc in the majority of studies. Further, paroxetine monotherapy shows a lack of clinically significant QTc prolongation in all studies. However, case reports or reporting tools still link these SSRIs with QTc prolongation. Fluoxetine, escitalopram, and sertraline used in post-acute coronary syndrome patients did not demonstrate risk of QTc prolongation.
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