Argentina Study Supports Ivermectin for COVID-19 (2020-09-26)

[-] stereomatch | 3 points | Oct 05 2020 18:31:31

EDIT: a comment below points to a video presentation (in spanish with english subtitles) for this study:

https://youtu.be/AAQ1WYjj3Co PREVIEW of study IVERMECTIN antiviral effectiveness Argentina Sep 19, 2020

and the language seems to suggest 600 micrograms/kg times 3 days is the type of dose they are talking of - so it is not just 3x the de-worming dose (200 micrograms/kg) takes for 2 or 3 days as I suggested below is typical for most ivermectin/covid19 studies.

But it is 3x that dose as well - so it is 3x daily dose as well as taking for 3 to 5 days also.

So it is about 3x the usual dose given in ivermectin studies.

However this is still not close to a toxic dose - since 10x the de-worming dose (2009micrograms/kg) has been given in earlier studies without great issue.

NOTE: the article mention of 0.6mg/kg dose being "three times" usual dose is just comparing to the usual one-time 200mcg/kg dose given for de-worming.

However for covid19, most studies are giving that dose over 2 or 3 days - which make that dosage similar to the 0.6mg/kg mentioned in this study.

0.6mg/kg = 600microgram/kg

For a 90kg person the typical de-worming dose of 200micrograms/kg (0.2mg/kg) means: 0.2mg x 90kg = 18mg

Ivermectin pills usually are available as 6mg tablets. That means a de-worming dose for a 90kg person would be 18mg (achievable with 3 x 6mg tablets = 18mg).

Most covid19 studies have used this dose per day - given over 2 days or 3 days.

For prophylaxis the dose usually mentioned is this dose once per week. While ivermectin has an 18-hour half-life, the idea behind a weekly dose is that if you catch the virus mid-week you are always within 3-4 days of a peak of ivermectin in plasma.

Scientists explained that the 0.6 mg/kg dose was three times the amount “usually used.” They said this dose, “produces the fastest and most profound elimination of the virus when treatment is started in the early stages of infection (up to 5 days from the onset of symptoms).” Awaited Verification Arrives Studies started in May, after the consortium was chosen for funding. About 6 million pesos was awarded. Testing was done with 45 patients with moderate or mild COVID-19. 30 got the high-dose ivermectin, and the remainder were controls. “Those who received the drug presented an antiviral response significantly different from those not treated, the effect was evidenced in the deeper decrease of virus in secretions”, Krolewieky explicated. He went on, “the most relevant thing is that it is the first study that demonstrates the effect of ivermectin in patients. All over the world a verification was being awaited to establish whether this drug has the potential to treat coronavirus patients.” Experts note that this is a first step, and that we, “will have to carry out other investigations to establish methods of clinical application and the eventual possibility of being used as a prevention tool.” High Dose, Rapid Virus Elimination Adrián Lifchitz, professor of Pharmacology at Unicen, was the lead for the study of ivermectin concentrations in plasma samples of the trial subjects. “We found that the medication produced a rapid viral elimination from the body and this helps to reduce the probability of infection. The effect that ivermectin causes on the rate of disappearance of the virus depends on the amount of the drug that is absorbed (amount that enters the organism), after taking it orally. This becomes a proof of concept of high scientific value: it confirms the need to use dose levels higher than those traditionally applied,” according to the Conicet researcher and member of Civetan.

Video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjSezLORshw&t=370 Clinical Trials and Research News Weekly Roundup - AdventHealth Ocala ICAM Protocol Takes on COVID Oct 5, 2020

[-] Z3rul | 5 points | Oct 05 2020 19:37:54

this was a concept proof study, the premise was to find the highest safest dose for humans while looking for load viral reduction and behavior.

results were positive with a rapid viral elimination with a 0.6mg/kg dose

watch this video if you wanna see the methodology and concepts used in the study

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAQ1WYjj3Co

the official papers aren't out yet. and this amazing findings are getting ignored worldwide

[-] Ok-Film-9049 | 6 points | Oct 06 2020 08:26:42

Saw the video and many thanks. This seems like good research. Looking at the control it appears that the measurement is still happening at the later stages of infection ie at the point when the body is just reaching/has reached peak concentration of virus. Interesting to hear about the manitiide of difference in viral load between patients. I assume those with lower viral loads will have better clinical outcomes.

The other research on ivermectins anti viral properties in animal models shows just how important it is to use ivermectin very close to infection.

I suspect we will only see whether ivermectin is truly working as an antiviral if used prophylactively or in patients who have been exposed.

Time may really be of the essence for its impact to reduce viral load.

That isn't to say that it may be very useful as a anti clotting and anti inflammatory Post peak viral load. These concepts have already been demonstrated pre covid

[-] Haitchpeasauce | 3 points | Oct 06 2020 10:05:39

The Zagazig University study used Ivermectin prophylacticly with household contacts resulting in lower infection among the treatment arm. In every study and anecdote it's the same: the earlier Ivermectin was given, the faster the recovery and less severe disease. Treating early leads to better outcomes, I thought this would be intuitive but so many covid articles focus on treating advanced cases and less on outpatient support. The prevalent attitude needs to shift away from doing nothing and waiting for patients to worsen before intervening. We are allowing the number of long hauler cases to continue to grow.

[-] Ok-Film-9049 | 3 points | Oct 06 2020 10:21:28

I couldn't agree more. i think the real problem is that there isn't enough human IVM in the supply chain for the demand. In the lower income countries, they are prepared to use animal grade IVM in the emergency. personally I would use animal grade IVM as a prophylactive but I cant see this happening on mass.

i think it will be one of those things that is looked back on in 10 years as ironic and costing many lives.

i still have a slight doubt in my mind that the research from Zagazig might not be genuine, but am close to becoming convinced, particularly because other studies pre-covid, have shown IVM to be effective as an anti-viral in animal models.

Are you confident of the prophylative research from the 3 studies?

[-] Haitchpeasauce | 2 points | Oct 06 2020 12:02:36

I share your doubt and await better studies and more studies from Western countries. They are coming but it has been a slow start.